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Can We Talk? Because It's Too Quiet!

Actually, of course, I'm going off to work shortly, so the talking would have to be tonight ... and worked in around the LJ server downtime that's scheduled at 9 pm ET.

Let's have an old-fashioned fangirl meme:

Comment with a pairing and I'll tell you:

1. When I started shipping them
2. What I think their challenge is
3. What makes me happy about them
4. What makes me sad about them
5. What moment I wish had never happened
6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other
7. My happily ever after for them

(If you comment with one I don't ship, or one about which I am agnostic, I'll tell you something about the whys and wherefores of my opinions.)

And if that doesn't float your boat - ask me something you've been wanting to know about me. (If it's too intensely personal, I'll move it and start a new locked post for it.)

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Comments

( 32 comments — Leave a comment )
avierra
Apr. 30th, 2010 01:43 pm (UTC)
Well, you know what I will ask, haha :D

585, of course.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 02:43 am (UTC)

But of course ... !

1. When I started shipping them:

By the time I got to the end of the "Be There" arc.

2. What I think their challenge is:

Mainly, to believe that they actually deserve happiness.

3. What makes me happy about them:

The way that they complete each other.

4. What makes me sad about them:

The way that they don't always speak that same language, so to speak.

5. What moment I wish had never happened:

I used to hate a lot of their "Burial" arc because of the recurring misunderstandings. But it was necessary to the development of their relationship in the story.

6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other:

There's no one else in canon that does that for me.

7. My happily ever after for them:

Well, that they settle down to some extent, back in Gojyo's little house (although they both really needs to be kept busy, I think - Hakkai intellectually and Gojyo physically). And that they manage to age at the same rate and die more or less at the same time ... although a scenario like devikun's "Tomorrow and Tomorrow" is quite likely, I realize. But even though that's an intensely sad story, I like what it says about what their life together must have been like up until that point.

smillaraaq
May. 1st, 2010 03:40 am (UTC)
I used to hate a lot of their "Burial" arc because of the recurring misunderstandings. But it was necessary to the development of their relationship in the story.

Hee...I think we've briefly discussed this before, that this is one of the big areas where our generally similar tastes diverge. I adore the Burial arc, and the pain of the awkwardness and misunderstanding at the beginning is precisely what makes the resolution so sweet to me. Mind you, it probably helps that due to Minekura's backwards-and-forwards storytelling style, we aren't seeing this in linear order and instead are flashing back to that painful stage after multiple volumes showing that they have been getting along perfectly well for several years now; the tension is substantially lessened since you know in advance that Gojyo isn't going to die in that basement and the awkward distance between them is only a temporary phase.

But even though that's an intensely sad story, I like what it says about what their life together must have been like up until that point.

Yes, this. That's why I can reread it over and over, even though it makes me cry every time: it hurts that it's coming to a close, but they've so obviously *had* their happy ending, long and loving years and years of it, and in this canon Gojyo's total faith that OF COURSE it's only a brief parting and they're fated to find each other again is more than just wishful thinking. *wibbles*
lawless523
Apr. 30th, 2010 02:38 pm (UTC)
Sanzo/Goku.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 02:52 am (UTC)

1. When I started shipping them:

Well, I didn't in a romatic way until quite recently. But Goku is growing up ... .

2. What I think their challenge is:

They both need to recognize what it is they actually want, and Sanzo needs to square it with his sense of his responsibilities.

3. What makes me happy about them:

The way that they always seem to be connected, even when they don't want to be.

4. What makes me sad about them:

The differences in age and life experience. Although Goku is theoretically centuries old, he didn't really have much of a life. And Sanzo had to grow up much too soon, so there's more of an emotional gap than the seeming age difference would indicate.

5. What moment I wish had never happened:

When Goku realizes that Gojyo is (seemingly) right: Sanzo has abandoned them.

6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other:

Eesh ... again, there isn't really an alternative for me.

7. My happily ever after for them:

Sanzo unties some of the knots in his psyche and is able to justify some kind of happiness, and Goku settles into doing something to do besides beating the crap out of bad guys (the scenario in "Cosmetic Surgery" where Goku ends up working in a bakery was pretty cute). I can't really see them actually setting up housekeeping together, though, even if they become lovers: neither of them is very domestic.

lawless523
May. 1st, 2010 12:16 pm (UTC)
Thanks!

They might not need to be domestic if they both stay at the monastery afterward. That's assuming, of course, that they're not killed off and returned to Tenkai during the final battle. I could, however, see the more mature Goku we're beginning to see in canon learning to cook and do some basic cleaning and straightening up from guess who if, for some reason, they're not at the monastery.
vom_marlowe
Apr. 30th, 2010 04:07 pm (UTC)
Do you ever read SGA stories? (Or see the show?)
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 02:54 am (UTC)

... no. (Sad but true: the best way to handle TV and me is to assume that if it's TV, I haven't seen it. I haven't watched TV regularly since about 1982.)

vom_marlowe
May. 1st, 2010 03:17 am (UTC)
I was curious because I read a lot of SGA stories without ever bothering to watch the show. (I first typed 'read the show' which is telling.) A lot of really great writers ended up there, for some reason, and I really have an affinity for the main pairing (John/Rodney). They feel rather like matched lost souls, in the way that Saiyuki does sometimes.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:20 am (UTC)

People keep suggesting that I do that with WK. But it's by working through their canon stories that people show what they mean to each other, you know? So I can't really see doing that.

vom_marlowe
May. 1st, 2010 03:29 am (UTC)
Well.... Yes and no. I think that's true for some canon, like Saiyuki. But for other canon, like WK, the canon is doing other things besides the relationships. The idea of florist assassins with awesome backstories and silly code names and various major plot arcs is more of a skeleton on which different relationships are hung by fanfic writers. WK isn't like Saiyuki--there are a whole lot more different pairings out there, and plenty of good reasons to like one or another. I think SGA and WK fanfic both tend to long, novel length fics because they need that long because they're developing relationships that are only sparks in canon.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:58 am (UTC)

Well, so where would I start, with either series? Assuming that I was going to try to do so ... ?

vom_marlowe
May. 1st, 2010 03:04 pm (UTC)
Heee! I love the puzzled Goku.

My buddy wedjateye got me hooked on SGA when I needed good fic for my PT reading. For SGA, basically what you need to know is that a bunch of scientists and military types go through a stargate to Atlantis, an awesome abandonded city, wake the Wraith (weirdo pscyhic vampires), and have adventures. John is the military commander, and Rodney is the science commander. There's a civilian commander in the beginning, Elizabeth, but that changes.

1. Ordinary Life, by Astolat and Speranza
http://www.intimations.org/fanfic/stargate/Ordinary%20Life.html

2. MVP, by Speranza. http://www.trickster.org/speranza/cesper/MVP.html

3. Weddings, Plural, and a Yak. by Speranza. http://www.trickster.org/speranza/cesper/weddingsplural.html

There are lots more, but those are a couple of my favorites. I'll get you some WK in a bit. I don't have the links handy (some things have moved about a bit.)
smillaraaq
May. 1st, 2010 03:24 pm (UTC)
Oooh, I remember Speranza from Due South fandom -- she did a bunch of very good Fraser/Ray K. stories.
ginnyvos
Apr. 30th, 2010 05:00 pm (UTC)
Gojyo/Goku/Gojyo
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 02:59 am (UTC)

How did I know you were going to come to the table with that?

XD

OK, the sensible reason I don't ship those two is that Hakkai is really the one who gets left out in the cold with this. And without Gojyo to keep him in the real world, Hakkai is going to go squirrely, and a squirrely Hakkai is a public menace.

The canon reason I don't ship those two is that Gojyo's and Hakkai's souls have been together for centuries. It's Meant To Be.

And the real, gut-level reason reason I don't ship them is just that the pairing does nothing for me on the sex appeal level.

ginnyvos
May. 2nd, 2010 07:24 pm (UTC)
*laughs* because Gojyo/Hakkai/Gojyo has been done a million times! ;)

Without kidding though, I love the pairing dearly, but I also can't see it happening unless Sanzo and Hakkai are out of the picture, either because they are physically unavailable (gone 'for ever') or because they are emotionally unavailable (A huge fight, a rejection which cannot be reasoned away, another romantic relationship). Of course, that's always in the eye of the beholder. But yes, if any of those came to pass, I believe the two of them could very well end up coping by getting together and that could very well evolve into real romantic love.

a_mael
Apr. 30th, 2010 10:26 pm (UTC)
Your preferred SDK ship, since Saiyuki's been all taken up.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:11 am (UTC)

Well, it's Onime-no-Kyo/Yukimura.

1. When I started shipping them:

When they had their first duel and Yukimura started talking philosophy - and Kyo actually listened to him.

2. What I think their challenge is:

Yukimura's sense of responsibility and political ambitions aren't going to let him follow Kyo indefinitely, and at the end of the day, regardless of how much I think he may have experimented, Kyo wants a lover with boobs. >sigh<

3. What makes me happy about them:

The snark and the sheer joy that they take in the fact that each regards the other as a challenge.

4. What makes me sad about them:

It's not going anywhere.

5. What moment I wish had never happened:

When Yukimura apparently betrays the Kyo-tachi to the Mibu. I really felt like I'd been kicked in the gut.

6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other:

The canon Kyo ship works as well for him as anything, for me. There isn't really anyone for Yuki-sama that I can belive in comfortably. (But I kind of like that bittersweetness about him.)

7. My happily ever after for them:

D-:

Sorry - there isn't one. But I'd like them to have one final fling before Yukimura's death, which is set by his RL counterpart's death at several years after the end of the series. Again, this is part of the attraction of the whole ship for me: that it's sad and won't end well.



Edited at 2010-05-01 03:35 am (UTC)
redbrunja
Apr. 30th, 2010 11:30 pm (UTC)
Whatever you ship in Harry Potter.
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:18 am (UTC)

Uh oh ... I don't really ship anyone in HP - none of them excite me much.

Cripes, I'm sorry, red - although I remember liking the idea of Neville/Luna, I can't remember enough to work through these questions without being very vague and making stuff up.

You're welcome to try again if you don't just want to wash your hands of the whole thing.

redbrunja
May. 6th, 2010 03:30 am (UTC)
No worries. I've had people do the same thing to me, where they ask about a fandom that I haven't paid attention to in YEARS or that I watched three episodes of.

And I don't think we've talked about this one: Bleach.
freeradical9
May. 1st, 2010 01:23 am (UTC)
avierra already asked after the pair that I'm most curious to hear about. How about Wild Adapter, Kubota/Tokito? :)
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:34 am (UTC)

Heh, the only WA icon I have on this account is Kou ... .

1. When I started shipping them:

LOL - when they're being bugged, and the Izumo thugs who are listening at the other end hear them apparently breaking into lusty gay sex - and then we see them in the apartment, and what they're really doing is sitting on the sofa, not even touching each other, hamming it up for their listeners. The way Tokito picked up on what Kubota was doing, and the snarky enthusiasm with which they're doing it, just clinched their togetherness for me.

2. What I think their challenge is:

Survival, pure and simple.

3. What makes me happy about them:

That they're are so together and yet both such tough little bastards.

4. What makes me sad about them:

It's all going to end in tears, probably in the next volume.

5. What moment I wish had never happened:

The scenes where Tokito is realizing that Kubota hasn't told him anywhere near the whole truth about his past (the Anna arc) were a little painful.

6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other:

Well, Kou would jump Kubo-chan's bones in a New York minute, I think. (And that might be a fun bit of smut.) But Kubota probably wouldn't trust Kou enough for it to be anything real. If, as in that recent fic, Shota could appear magically all grown up, I think he and Tokito could have fun messing around, and it might grow into something more.

7. My happily ever after for them:

They'd have to leave the country to have such a thing - rather like Trevor and Zach at the end of Brite's Drawing Blood. Maybe they could escape to Roanapur (in Black Lagoon) and set up business there. But otherwise, see #4.

freeradical9
May. 2nd, 2010 02:20 am (UTC)
when they're being bugged, and the Izumo thugs who are listening at the other end hear them apparently breaking into lusty gay sex

LOL! I'd forgotten about that scene. Great description of their behavior, they really do click at that moment. :D

Kubota probably wouldn't trust Kou enough for it to be anything real

I hadn't thought about that. I guess you're right, I could see them together as a fling thing, but certainly nothing permanent--definitely lacking in the trust factor on both sides.

The comment about Shota was so cute. That's another one I hadn't thought of before, but yeah, I could see that with an older Shota.

Very interesting answers! Thanks for posting the meme. :D
smillaraaq
May. 1st, 2010 01:41 am (UTC)
10K counts as a different ship, technically, yes? XD

Or if you prefer...Rock/Revy!
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:47 am (UTC)

It's kind of pointless doing a happily-ever-after for 10K, though! I guess endless inventive sex through the ages ... .

Let's try the Lagoon crew:

1. When I started shipping them:

The first time Rock started mouthing off at Revy instead of being intimidated by her axe-craziness.

2. What I think their challenge is:

Well, Rock's got to admit what he's feeling, for a start (Revy has started doing so, poor thing). And then, like the WA boys, they need to survive.

3. What makes me happy about them:

That they reverse so many of the classic m/f tropes, and manage to do it without making Revy particularly mannish or Rock particularly helpless.

4. What makes me sad about them:

That they can't take a moment to breathe and realize what they're becoming to each other.

5. What moment I wish had never happened:

Hmmm ... there hasn't really been that type of pain, I think. But Revy's trying to get her feelings across to Rock without looking vulnerable was very sad.

6. Who I'd be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other:

No one in canon, actually. Eda would do Rock in a heartbeat, but he wouldn't want her. And Revy would never trust anyone else enough except for Benny and Dutch - and she just doesn't have any of that sexual element toward either of them. She doesn't respect Benny enough, I think, and she respects Dutch too much.

7. My happily ever after for them:

Gawd, could they have one? What would Revy do in a happily ever after scenario?? Maybe they can open a bar, and he can run the place and she can be the bouncer.

But I really think it's all going to end in a hailstorm of bullets and blood.

smillaraaq
May. 1st, 2010 12:23 pm (UTC)
It's kind of pointless doing a happily-ever-after for 10K, though!

That would be the 585 reincarnation fic, of course! XD Or the occasional cunning AU, but really I think escaping from the stagnation of heaven and finally really *living* is just what they needed...

Well, Rock's got to admit what he's feeling, for a start (Revy has started doing so, poor thing).

D'you think he actually understands what she's trying to say, though? She's pretty indirect and oblique, and while Rock is a very smart boy in general, I'm not sure how well that Tenpou-ish mad tactical genius extends towards emotional subtlety...

And Revy would never trust anyone else enough except for Benny and Dutch - and she just doesn't have any of that sexual element toward either of them. She doesn't respect Benny enough, I think, and she respects Dutch too much.

I definitely agree there doesn't seem to be any element of sexual tension with either of the other guys (plus Benny and Jane seem to be getting along quite happily), but I'm not sure I'd read Revy as actively disrespecting Benny? They just don't particularly seem like they could really make much of a connection since their jobs, personalities, etc. are so different; while Rock is in a similar brains vs. brawn position with her, he's not tied to the ship like Benny is, so there's more direct on-the-job partnership for them to build up familiarity and trust. (Plus I'd imagine that Rock's typical jobs as a negotiator, translator, tactician, etc. are easier for her to understand than Benny's arcane geek-fu.) And the vibe between her and Dutch feels very grizzled C.O. and trusted young soldier, in a completely platonic way -- even if she were the sort to develop a complex over a substitute father-figure (which she doesn't strike me as being), Dutch seems far too level-headed and sensible to go for that level of fraternization. I could *maaaaaaaaaaybe* see something with Chang or Balalaika, since they're the only other characters she seems to have a similarly warm respect for, but the age and status differences and power dynamics, as frequent employers of Lagoon Company, isn't all that far off from a direct-chain-of-command thing...

What would Revy do in a happily ever after scenario?? Maybe they can open a bar, and he can run the place and she can be the bouncer.

Yeah...she's such a violence-and-adrenaline junkie, it's hard to picture her settling down in any real sort of way. Maybe transitioning from their current hands-on transport/piracy to more bodyguard work, like in the yakuza arc? It's really difficult to picture her being happy doing something without an element of danger...

But I really think it's all going to end in a hailstorm of bullets and blood.

That is pretty much the classical ending for the sort of stories Wild Adapter and Black Lagoon are telling, alas. About the best I can bring myself to hope for is that they'll go out like Ginji and Yukio -- together, after fighting a good fight and coming to some sort of mutual understanding about their feelings...
lady_ganesh
May. 1st, 2010 03:47 am (UTC)
I cannot remember if you ship Koumyou/Ukoku, but I'd like to hear your thoughts either way!
chomiji
May. 1st, 2010 03:57 am (UTC)

Yikes ... I can't say I really ship Ukoku with anyone. I don't find actual evil sexy - especially his his brand of "everyone else is an insect" evil. In fact, I think the only reason I've been able to even read any of the Koumyou/Ukoku stories is that Koumyou is the only being who is actually a person to him (and that's why, I think, he has to destroy him).

It's perhaps telling that my favorite story about the sleazebag (and the only one that I re-read regularly) is louiselux's "Heart of Darkness."

lady_ganesh
May. 1st, 2010 02:33 pm (UTC)
That is a damn good story, that is.

I have two Nii icons and no Koumyou. I should fix this.
macavitykitsune
May. 3rd, 2010 05:51 am (UTC)
I hope I'm not too late!
Kougaiji/Yaone/Dokugakuji in whichever combination you prefer ♥
( 32 comments — Leave a comment )

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